chat with me

Time for a new School of the Web experiment. I thought we'd try a chat Q&A/teach-in sort of thing.

I've very rarely used any kind of chat stuff so I might need some technical advice. I have iChat on m'mac - will that do? is it interoperable with all the big popular chat things you lot might be using? Or do I need to get some thing off someone else? Hotmail or Google or someone? Any suggestions?

I'm thinking of 6pm (BST) on Tuesday 23rd of May. How does that work for you, where you are?

If this works I think it might be fun to do it regularly, maybe in conjunction with feedback on the assignments, speaking of which, I'll get a new one up soon.

Or maybe we'll move on to that skypecast thing. Or does anyone know how to jaunt?

Comments

[JamesB]

chat don't scale too well and you're a popular fella... but i'm up for giving it a go and trying to get a word in edgeways :-). would it help to get people to post questions in comments prior to chat to help with structure? like a q&a with pre-prepared themes.

could find a platform neutral chat client or more easily do it with gmail chat.

[russell]

ah, you see that's the kind of expertise I need. maybe we should set a limit on numbers or something. I dunno. lets experiment.

I'm hoping it'll be more about discussion than we just saying stuff, but maybe that's naive.

[RajaB]

It is a good idea taking the school on to a chat platform. But I am with James on the question of having a structured chat more than a "here's another chat room" approach.
As you have suggested, it would be a good idea to limit the number too.

[Charles]

mIRC. It's old skool but is populated with early bulletin board internet pioneers who still use it for very good reasons like you can 'own' a channel, promote people to be operators (ops who can kick unwanted users off), restrict users during Q&A sessions to invite only, and then open it up globally for young planner and brand thinker discussions once restricted sessions are over. There are also lots and lots of people on the #irchelp channels who are just waiting to help. It takes some time to set up but it's the most flexible if I'm not mistaken. http://www.mirc.com/
to register a channel you need to check out http://www.undernet.org/ to register a channel.

[Pete Ashton]

iChat works on the same protocol as AIM but you'd be best off with a multi-protocol app like Adium http://www.adiumx.com/

Works with AIM, Yahoo, MSN and other and has a cute duck.

[Ju Laporta]

i think the chat must have a theme, and that we should come to the class prepared (with questions and readings / material).
i haven´t been in a chat room since 1995 :o).... i don´t know if we can post photos/images but that would be excellent too.
i´ll be there for sure!

[stuart parkinson]

Another vote for AdiumX, it is a chat client for OS X which supports everything under the sun.

However, for a multiuser chat, IRC has to be the best way.

I could set something up on an irc server on a forum i frequent (www.arstechnica.com)

then anyone would be able to join and chat, but it would require an IRC client.

[Carol]

I was at a 'blogging conference' in DC two weeks ago and during the entire conference, there was internet chat going on, available on your laptop if you had wi-fi and also posted on a screen behind the stage(unreadable).

It was "hosted" which means the comments didn't go up immediately, they were vetted.

I'd say more than 50% of the comments were just people being amusing, cracking jokes. If you think about it, it's hard to be asked a question and to mull it over, all in the instantaneous way chat rooms normally go.

What about "live blogging" though? If something was on, everyone could watch it and put their comments up - the one for the Oscars at Pajama Media was hilarious.

[Piers Fawkes]

why don;t you consider Skypecast?

[Michelle]

Oooh 6pm (BST) that's 3am in Sydney. Any chance we can do a more sleep friendly hour?

[Vandy]

Fantastic idea!

Unfortunately, I will be at work in San Francisco. I hope I can log in and chat - that'll be around 10 AM PST. Worth a shot, don't want to miss it.

iChat is the best - people on AIM/Google chat can join in, we just have to open up Jabber and add them in.

As Adium is to Mac, people on a PC can look into Trillian ... http://www.ceruleanstudios.com/

[Servant of Chaos]

The folks over at www.decisiveflow.com/blog often have advanced warning of cool (and effective) online tools for collaboration. Yesterday they were talking about Skypecasts. Might be worth checking out.

[russell]

So, popular sentiment is swinging towards Skypecasts. I could by that, that sounds fun and oh so leading edge. Are enough of you up for that?

And on timing - I'm afraid there's no good time for everyone. So we'll move it around. It'll be UK morning next time. Assuming there is a next time.

[Claire]

Russell,

Count me in.
Great idea.
Agree that a firm topic will be useful.
We don't all have to talk.
For myself, I plan to be in listening mode.

Best,
Claire

[Colman]

I wouldn't mind lurking like Claire.

[russell]

I'm starting to feel this is too much pressure.

Anyway, if we're going to have an agenda, any suggestions for the topic?

[Colman]

We could discuss the need for an agenda.

[russell]

we don't want to rush things.

[Colman]

Quite right.

How about discussing whether we need a discussion about the need for an agenda?

[russell]

well, I'm prepared to consider debating whether that should be put up for a vote. If everyone's happy to think about the possibility of discussing that. Maybe. TBC.

[Colman]

I'm definitely sure we should think about considering it, I think.

[Andy Ruddock]

Not exactly on topic, but I was wondering if this school has any plans to think about how branding and marketing might work in the public sector?

Having had a look over your stuff, plus Grant's blog on social anthro, eth and marketing, I was struck by how many of the ideas apply to work I'm doing with the Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service. Russell knows about this, but for everyone else I'm a Media Studies lecturer who is currently researching youth outreach programmes staged by said service, whose goal is to reduce fire offending by rebranding themselves among young people. Fire crews in this area are quite often attacked, or even ambushed by groups of youths who see them as just another uniformed service. The idea is that by running 12 week training programmes to groups of 10-15 young people at a time, the fire service can differentiate itself from other uniformed services, thus sending sorts of "fire ambassadors" back into the community who will then spread this rebranded message by word of mouth. So its basically a long exercise in conditioning th experience that young people have with MFRS as a brand-and the Fire Service wouldn't have a problem with the exercise being described in this way.

I suppose where the distinction lies with commercial advertising is that, in the end, the brand itself does have a "preferred meaning" that it wants to get across. i.e. some brands might be comfortable with being perceived in a variety of (sometimes less than positive) ways (I'm thinking of the piece that Grant wrote on making your own Chevy ad), where MFRS want to be seen as a modern community centred service. However, in doing this project, I'm using a variety of methods and data; surveys the service have collected themselves from students, parents and teachers; interviews with past students and staff; focus group and workshop exercises; creative media projects (I want to get the present students to make their own video scripting their experience of the course). Already some of these ideas are working, and some are not. and one of the huge challenges I'm facing is communicating to both staff and students what on earth I'm doing.

So, the question is, is this anything that would fit into the marketing school, or is there anywhere else on this or other blogs where I might be able to discuss the project?

[Colman]

It’s a fascinating and difficult sounding question, and, in my opinion, excellent subject material for discussion here (or somewhere similar).

I find it interesting because in my view branding is about ‘relationships’ (increasingly so), and relationships are complicated and of course fluid buggers. When psychologists evaluate whether a relationship is ‘good’ they use the following criteria (amongst others); duration, proximity seeking, rewards, commitment, conversation, meshing, empathy, concern, warmth, and knowledge. I think these aspects can also be useful in understanding people’s relationships with brands. It becomes more a case of ‘preferred relationship’ rather than ‘preferred meaning’.

[Colman]

It’s a fascinating and difficult sounding question, and, in my opinion, excellent subject material for discussion here (or somewhere similar).

I find it interesting because in my view branding is about ‘relationships’ (increasingly so), and relationships are complicated and of course fluid buggers. When psychologists evaluate whether a relationship is ‘good’ they use the following criteria (amongst others); duration, proximity seeking, rewards, commitment, conversation, meshing, empathy, concern, warmth, and knowledge. I think these aspects can also be useful in understanding people’s relationships with brands. It becomes more a case of ‘preferred relationship’ rather than ‘preferred meaning’.

[Andy Ruddock]

Helpful already!

All of these ideas really apply to what's going on in the programme. I suppose the overall goal can be defined in terms of "proximity seeking". The firefighters are trying to overcome the social distance that defines them as "just another uniform", but at the same time they are aware that they have to travel to where the young people are too. This is partly due to the way that Young people are "branded" locally (and of course nationally). One of the local newspapers is running an anti-ASB campaign, and has selected a faceless teen in a hoody as the logo-I'm sure this is happenning all over. This is of huge concern to MFRS; I was in a project planning meeting and the phrase "moral panic" was used-and it didn't come out of my mouth (as the sociological presence in the room) but from that of a high ranking fire officer.

Duration is another good one. From a mass communication point of view, this goes all the way back to the origins of persuasion research in US agricultural sociology; how do you get people to adopt innovations, and how do you get them to remain adopters? In this topic, there's no doubt among students, parents, teachers or youth workers that the programme has positive outcomes on the way that the young people who take part look at themselves and the world, but the question is, how do you maintain these relationships?

Funnily enough, when I was at the centre last week ( I should mention that I'm also doing participant observation) an ex student dropped by just to say hello. I grabbed him for an interview and began to suspect he was a plant; he really felt the programme had turned his life around, and he had just won a place at university. One of the things that he mentioned was that the youth team had created the impression that they were there for him after the programme (so I suppose there's your warmth & empathy).

I would see empathy as related to conversation-and again, one of the distinctions past students have made is between the programme and school. they seem to feel that the firefighters talk to them and listen, rather than demanding respect.

However, I think this comes down to certain structural relations and how the students frame the experience. As much as they learn a lot from the programme, it is, as they understand it, a day away from maths and physics. Also, some of the youth workers use clever ways of inspiring awe under the guise of winning empathy. One of the guys is an ex-firefighter with about 30 years of service. He recently completed an iron man triathalon, and the kids were asking him about it. One of them asked if he had any pictures. He said he did, and was happy to show them. when he passed the folder around, the first picture was of him in the marines about 30 years ago, armed to the teeth, in the jungle. The bloke doesn't have to shout after that.

In terms of knowledge, the things about fire safety and fire related ASB are embedded in all sorts of physical activities-clever, as the students tend to not like sitting around being talked at for long periods of time-if I'm doing anything with them, I have to keep it to 20 mins max.

Rambling now-but more comments please-that one was very evocative. Happy to filed questions too.